atvquadsquad.com    atvquadsquad.com    atvquadsquad.com  Hop To Forum Categories  Polaris    Polaris 700 Engine Rebuild
Page 1 2 

Moderators: Cajun
Go
New
Find
Notify
Tools
Reply
  
Polaris 700 Engine Rebuild
 Login/Join
 
New Member
posted
Well I'm fighting with a warranty company on trying to get my engine rebuilt, but if that goes through I'm going to be stuck with the bill. A dealer quoted me 3600 repair bill( The bike isn't even worth that much). Of course that's with their high prices and high labor rate. I can do the labor my self, so I'm just looking at parts.

Anyway, a crankshaft bearing is bad, and the piston rod rattles. Funny thing is we just had the warranty company replace the whole crankshaft assembly <700 miles ago, and its bad again. This time they wont cover it due to lack of maintenance. They are also saying its ingested dirt, ruined the valve guides, valves don't seal right, and scored the cylinder walls, and rings are bad.

So based on that, the dealer suggested we replace everything, including a new head. I would rather save the 500 bucks for a new head, and get the walls bored out. I'm not too familiar with the high performance/aftermarket engine parts for the 700's, but what are my options as far as factory cost vs aftermarket? What are a few websites i can poke around at?

Its for a 2006 sportsman 700 efi.
 
Posts: 8 | Registered: February 28, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
New Member
posted Hide Post
There has been nothing but electrical problems ( tps sensor and wiring replaced twice, and still spits and sputters) and we have gotten to the point where this machine just isn't reliable to be riding out in the Arizona trails. Now that we have an engine problem, we arn't sure if we are going to keep it, and fix it up to where its enjoyable again, and fun, or put it back to stock, and trade it in. We don't have an unlimited budget either.
 
Posts: 8 | Registered: February 28, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Forum Contributor
Moderator
Senior Member
Picture of tbg120
posted Hide Post
There isn't a whole lot available performance wise as far as high compression pistons etc... There are camshafts and ported heads etc... For $3,600.00 I would go out and find a good used 800 to drop in. There are usually a few on E-Bay. Performance wise you would be much further ahead.


TBG120
2009 RZR S
 
Posts: 1101 | Location: Northeast, Ohio | Registered: November 01, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
New Member
posted Hide Post
Thats the type of information im looking for! Dealer said an 800 wouldn't ahem.."fit" and id need to re wire the whole quad. How much smoke are they blowing?
 
Posts: 8 | Registered: February 28, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of 2pfspiff
posted Hide Post
I don't know off hand, but i would say being the fact that they are both twins and the Hp is not so far off from each other then it probably should drop right in. The only thing that might get you is the computer. I would imagine that the mapping of an 800 computer is diferent then a 700 computer.
 
Posts: 470 | Location: NJ | Registered: March 06, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post


It Is Lonely At The Top!
Picture of Cob
posted Hide Post
How are they coming up with the lack of maintence thing? How are they claiming that dirt got into engine?


Working for GOD is ok, the retirement plan is out of this world
atvquadsquad@yahoo.com

 
Posts: 20004 | Location: Thornton COBORADO | Registered: October 14, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Moderator
Been There, Done That!
Picture of Cajun
posted Hide Post
Another thing, the cylinder cannot be bored, only replaced. The cylinder has a nikasil coating, so if it gets damaged it has to be replaced. $3,600 is ridiculous. I'm pretty sure a 700 computer can be reflashed to 800 specs.


2004.5 Mossy Oak 700
2007 Stealth 800
 
Posts: 11947 | Location: Louisiana | Registered: February 25, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Moderator
Been There, Done That!
Picture of Cajun
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Cob:
How are they coming up with the lack of maintence thing? How are they claiming that dirt got into engine?

Sounds like they rebuilt it once and they're done on payouts.


2004.5 Mossy Oak 700
2007 Stealth 800
 
Posts: 11947 | Location: Louisiana | Registered: February 25, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Advanced Member
posted Hide Post
I'd go with the 800 swap, I've seen them on e-bay for $2000 and less. Does anyone know if the rzr motor is the same? I'm not sure if the mounting points are the same. Also try to find a complete motor with the throttle body,starter ect.
 
Posts: 637 | Registered: July 11, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
New Member
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Cob:
How are they coming up with the lack of maintence thing? How are they claiming that dirt got into engine?


Well, i faxed them, and showed a full service record including oil change, a dealer oil change( due to a miss communication they drained the oil) and another oil change receipt i had laying around. I did everything by the book- every 100 hours. Since they rebuilt the engine in the beginning of 2010, we have gone less than 700 miles, and something around 180hours im estimating. So that's 2 oil changes done WITHIN the 200 hour specs...well i talk to the warranty adjuster and he said because i ride in Arizona, it has to be done every 50 hours due to "harsh and extreme riding conditions". Hence the "lack of maintenance" It doesn't say that in my book, and the dealers i deal with say every 100 hours is fine.Then we argued back and fourth and started talking about how my UNI foam filter was "dirty". He said the filter is the reason it dusted the motor. Well i have proof the filter has been on since April, and we have only done 4 rides since then. So according to me, the filter isn't the culprit. The filter is dirty because its an oiled foam filter, and its doing its flipping job!!!

Ive been trying to get a hold of the warranty company direct and have a logical conversation with someone else. This machine has been maintained by the book. The only ammo they have on me is the UNI filter, but that doesn't cause a crankshaft bearing to go!
 
Posts: 8 | Registered: February 28, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post


It Is Lonely At The Top!
Picture of Cob
posted Hide Post
Ask them if they ever heard of MAGNUSON MOSS ACT if they require extra maintenance then is up to them to provide it. As long as you are maintaining the machine in an approved way they can not complain. Many ppl use the same filter with good results their arguement don't hold water. It would be on their shoulders to prove what they are claiming. As long as you use as good or better replacement you are good to go.


Working for GOD is ok, the retirement plan is out of this world
atvquadsquad@yahoo.com

 
Posts: 20004 | Location: Thornton COBORADO | Registered: October 14, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post


It Is Lonely At The Top!
Picture of Cob
posted Hide Post
Magnuson -moss


From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act (P.L. 93-637) is a United States federal law (15 U.S.C. § 2301 et seq.). Enacted in 1975, it is the federal statute that governs warranties on consumer products.

The Act was sponsored by Senator Warren G. Magnuson of Washington and Congressman John E. Moss of California, both Democrats.

Contents [hide]
1 Purpose
2 Definitions used
3 Requirements
3.1 Full Warranty Requirements
4 Limitations
5 Remedies under the Act
6 See also
7 Sources
8 References
9 External links


[edit] Purpose
According to the Report of the House of Representatives which accompanied the law (House Report No. 93-1197, 93d Cong 2d Sess.) the Magnuson-Moss act was enacted by Congress in response to the widespread misuse by merchants of express warranties and disclaimers. The legislative history indicates that the purpose of the Act is to make warranties on consumer products more readily understood and enforceable and to provide the Federal Trade Commission with means to better protect consumers.[1]

The statute is remedial in nature and is intended to protect consumers from deceptive warranty practices. Consumer products are not required to have warranties, but if one is given, it must comply with the Magnuson-Moss Act.

[edit] Definitions used
The Magnuson-Moss Act contains many definitions:

A "consumer" is a buyer of consumer goods for personal use. A buyer of consumer products for resale is not a consumer.
A "supplier" is any person engaged in the business of making a consumer product directly or indirectly available to consumers.
A "warrantor" is any supplier or other person who gives or offers a written warranty or who has some obligation under an implied warranty.
A "consumer product" is generally any tangible personal property for sale and that is normally used for personal, family, or household purposes. It is important to note that the determination whether a good is a consumer product requires a factual finding, on a case-by-case basis. Najran Co. for General Contracting and Trading v. Fleetwood Enterprises, Inc., 659 F. Supp. 1081 (S.D. Ga. 1986).
A "written warranty" (also called an express warranty) is any written promise made in connection with the sale of a consumer product by a supplier to a consumer that relates to the material and/or workmanship and that affirms that the product is defect-free or will meet a certain standard of performance over a specified time.
An "implied warranty" is defined in state law. The Magnuson-Moss Act simply provides limitations on disclaimers and provides a remedy for their violation.
Designations:
A "full warranty" is one that meets the federal minimum standards for a warranty. Such warranties must be "conspicuously designated" as full warranties. If each of the following five statements is true about your warranty's terms and conditions, it is a "full" warranty:
You do not limit the duration of implied warranties.
You provide warranty service to anyone who owns the product during the warranty period; that is, you do not limit coverage to first purchasers.
You provide warranty service free of charge, including such costs as returning the product or removing and reinstalling the product when necessary.
You provide, at the consumer's choice, either a replacement or a full refund if, after a reasonable number of tries, you are unable to repair the product.
You do not require consumers to perform any duty as a precondition for receiving service, except notifying you that service is needed, unless you can demonstrate that the duty is reasonable.
A "limited warranty" is one that does not meet the federal minimums. Such warranties must be "conspicuously designated" as limited warranties.
A "multiple warranty" is part full and part limited.
A "service contract" is different from a warranty because service contracts do not affirm the quality or workmanship of a consumer product. A service contract is a written instrument in which a supplier agrees to perform, over a fixed period of time or for a specified duration, services relating to the maintenance or repair, or both, of a consumer product. Agreements that meet the statutory definition of service contracts, but are sold and regulated under state law as contracts of insurance, do not come under the Act's provisions.
Disclaimer or Limitation of Implied Warranties when a service contract is sold:
Sellers of consumer products who make service contracts on their products are prohibited under the Act from disclaiming or limiting implied warranties. (Remember also that sellers who extend written warranties on consumer products cannot disclaim implied warranties, regardless of whether they make service contracts on their products.) However, sellers of consumer products that merely sell service contracts as agents of service contract companies and do not themselves extend written warranties can disclaim implied warranties on the products they sell.

[edit] Requirements
The Act provides that any warrantor warranting a consumer product to a consumer by means of a written warranty must disclose, fully and conspicuously, in simple and readily understood language, the terms and conditions of the warranty to the extent required by rules of the Federal Trade Commission. The FTC has enacted regulations governing the disclosure of written consumer product warranty terms and conditions on consumer products actually costing the consumer more than $15. The Rules can be found at 16 C.F.R. Part 700.

Under the terms of the Act, ambiguous statements in a warranty are construed against the drafter of the warranty.

Likewise, service contracts must fully, clearly, and conspicuously disclose their terms and conditions in simple and readily understood language.

Warrantors cannot require that only branded parts be used with the product in order to retain the warranty.[2] This is commonly referred to as the "tie-in sales" provisions[3], and is frequently mentioned in the context of third-party computer parts, such as memory and hard drives.

[edit] Full Warranty Requirements
Under a full warranty, in the case of a defect, malfunction, or failure to conform with the written warranty, the warrantor:

must, as a minimum, remedy the consumer product within a reasonable time and without charge;
may not impose any limitation on the duration of any implied warranty on the product;
may not exclude or limit consequential damages for a breach of any written or implied warranty on the product, unless the exclusion or limitation conspicuously appears on the face of the warranty; and
if the product, or a component part, contains a defect or malfunction, must permit the consumer to elect either a refund or replacement without charge, after a reasonable number of repair attempts.
In addition, the warrantor may not impose any duty, other than notification, upon any consumer, as a condition of securing the repair of any consumer product that malfunctions, is defective, or does not conform to the written warranty. However, the warrantor may require consumers to return a defective item to its place of purchase for repair.

[edit] Limitations
The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act does not invalidate or restrict any right or remedy of any consumer under any other federal law, nor does the Act supersede the Federal Trade Commission Act as it pertains to antitrust actions.

The Act does not invalidate or restrict any right or remedy of any consumer under state law. The Act is not the dominant regulation of consumer product warranties, and while it prescribes certain disclosures and restricts certain limitations on warranties, it leaves other warranty law untouched.[4]

Although the Act covers warranties on repair or replacement parts in consumer products, warranties on services for repairs are not covered.

The federal minimum standards for full warranties are waived if the warrantor can show that the problem associated with a warranted consumer product was caused by damage while in the possession of the consumer, or by unreasonable use, including a failure to provide reasonable and necessary maintenance.

[edit] Remedies under the Act
The Act is meant to provide consumers with access to reasonable and effective remedies where there is a breach of warranty on a consumer product. The Act provides for informal dispute-settlement procedures and for actions brought by the government and by private parties.

The FTC has been mandated by Congress to promulgate rules to encourage the use of alternative dispute resolution, and full warranties may require mediation and/or arbitration as a first step toward settling disputes.

In addition, the federal government has the authority to take injunctive action against a supplier or warrantor who fails to meet the requirements of the act.

Finally, consumers may seek redress in the courts for alleged violations of the Magnuson-Moss Act. A consumer who has been injured by the noncompliance of a supplier may bring an action in in federal court if the amount in controversy is over $25, or a class action if the number of class plaintiffs is greater than 100. If the jurisdictional amount, or number of plaintiffs, do not meet these thresholds, an action under the act may be brought only in state court.[5] Moreover, one of the key aids to the effectiveness of the Act is that a prevailing plaintiff may recover reasonable costs of suit, including attorney fees.[6]

[edit] See also


Working for GOD is ok, the retirement plan is out of this world
atvquadsquad@yahoo.com

 
Posts: 20004 | Location: Thornton COBORADO | Registered: October 14, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
New Member
posted Hide Post
Heres some pics of the engine. Tell me what you guys think.

What valve is the intake valve? Small or large?



















Heres the bearing and the rod that rattles. This is probably the noise that we heard when we shut it down and towed it home on the trail.
 
Posts: 8 | Registered: February 28, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Advanced Member
posted Hide Post
An air filter will not let dirt into the crankcase. The way dirt gets into the crankcase is if you ingest dirty water into the intake (swamp it).
 
Posts: 637 | Registered: July 11, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
New Member
posted Hide Post
Ive gone through my fare share of water, but it was never submerged, and nothing over a wheel. Mud bogging in Arizona doesn't work to well!
 
Posts: 8 | Registered: February 28, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Moderator
Been There, Done That!
Picture of Cajun
posted Hide Post
It's hard to tell from the pictures, but the cylinders don't look that bad. I can't really tell anything about the pistons from the pictures, but the skirts do look a little rough. Did you perform a compression or leak down test before tearing it apart? Was it burning oil?


2004.5 Mossy Oak 700
2007 Stealth 800
 
Posts: 11947 | Location: Louisiana | Registered: February 25, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
New Member
posted Hide Post
I dont know how the dealer came to a conclusion to tear it down. From what i know they didnt do any tests on it, not to mention they didnt even tell me they were going to tear it down.

We had to add oil a few times. Ive always checked the oil before each ride, its been low a few times. I also know for a fact that when i checked it before its last ride, it was a sad below safe.
 
Posts: 8 | Registered: February 28, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Moderator
Been There, Done That!
Picture of Cajun
posted Hide Post
Well, I would definitely put a new oil pump in the engine while you've got it down. Looking at your pics on my high resolution screens, I think I'd just put new rings on the pistons if you decide to rebuild.


2004.5 Mossy Oak 700
2007 Stealth 800
 
Posts: 11947 | Location: Louisiana | Registered: February 25, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Advanced Member
posted Hide Post
The way those pistons are carboned up I'd say it was buring oil. I had to replace both my pistons in my 700 last year, they didn't have near that much carbon and it didn't burn oil. Are you using synthetic 0w40 engine oil?
 
Posts: 637 | Registered: July 11, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Senior Member
posted Hide Post
If the intake tract behind the air cleaner was clean, the filter didn't let any dirt past. About the only way that a UNI filter would let dirt past would be if it was installed wrong or not oiled. In either case, dirt in the intake air would stick to the sides of the intake tract.
 
Posts: 1600 | Location: Comstock, Nebraska | Registered: October 19, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
  Powered by Social Strata Page 1 2  
 

atvquadsquad.com    atvquadsquad.com    atvquadsquad.com  Hop To Forum Categories  Polaris    Polaris 700 Engine Rebuild

All text and graphics are the property of atvquadsquad.com
test